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The Gillard Experiment has Failed.

May 3, 2012

Julia Gillard’s popularity has collapsed to a near record low of just 28% in a continuing trend that would see Labor annihilated if an election were to be held today.

On the crucial election-deciding two-party preferred basis, the Coalition leads Labor by 12 points reflecting a consistent pattern for some twelve months now that Labor faces almost certain defeat at the next election.

Despite the dire predicament for Labor, the Prime Minister insists that she will lead the party to the next election dismissing reports that her colleagues have given her a 1 July deadline to turn the party’s fortunes around.

Her ability to sell the May budget will apparently be the litmus test, however given Ms Gillard’s inability to sell the government’s achievements to date her prospects don’t look good.

The Prime Minister has failed to arrest a consistent decline in the polls following the unceremonious knifing of her predecessor Kevin Rudd.   Despite Mr Rudd being twice as popular amongst the electorate than Julia Gillard, Labor stalwarts threw their support behind Ms Gillard in the leadership showdown earlier this year, a move they may now be regretting.

The clumsy, incompetent and poorly timed response to the Peter Slipper and Craig Thomson affairs reflect poorly on Julia Gillard’s political judgement and many Labor MPs must be seriously considering their own prospects as well as their leader’s ability to reverse the party’s fortunes.

Whether Labor opt to oust Gillard before the next election remains to be seen, however one thing is certain, it’s all over for Gillard.

 

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124 Comments leave one →
  1. el gordo permalink
    May 3, 2012 3:05 pm

    And she plans a tough budget to get Swany’s surplus.

    Wonders will never cease, even the Bolter is putting in a plea to save the party.

  2. May 3, 2012 3:06 pm

    Julia appoints new spin doctor (to re-arrange the deckchairs presumably)….

    http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/8460639/gillard-appoints-new-media-staffer

  3. el gordo permalink
    May 3, 2012 3:33 pm

    It may be of no relevance in this hard world of political science, but in astrological circles there is talk that Julia will have a ‘crisis of faith’ with the solar eclipse on the 20th May.

    Astrology is an inexact science, so I have no faith in the prediction.

  4. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2012 3:35 pm

    From the article: “He has spent the past seven months as principal media adviser to Queensland premier Anna Bligh, before her Labor government lost in an historic landslide.”

    This is going to be good to watch! You can’t argue with a track record like that. He’ll probably advise Gillard to go after Abbott’s in-laws.

    Another great Gillard decision. Labor in trouble – get a new spin doctor.

  5. Meta permalink
    May 3, 2012 3:52 pm

    “[I]t’s all over for Gillard”. Repeat daily as nooze. Either that, or stay curious, I guess.

  6. Meta permalink
    May 3, 2012 4:27 pm

    (Just as a matter of (rhetorical) observation, one wonders if the scan-dalous ‘negative’ environment has assisted an LNP-Abbott alt-government to ‘sell’ its flurry of preemptive ‘positive’ policy (re)announcements over the past few weeks, aside from Hockey’s shrinking pies with (dis)entitlement sauce speech about a ‘Return to the Age of Fixation with Smallera Government and Lessera Taxes’, which received some coverage.)

  7. el gordo permalink
    May 3, 2012 5:00 pm

    Paul Sheehan highlights the state of Australian politics.

    ‘If Gillard goes she would be the sixth federal leader of the two major parties to be removed in six years. Only one, John Howard, was removed by the voters. The rest – Kim Beazley, Dr Brendan Nelson, Malcolm Turnbull and Rudd – were removed by their own parties.’

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/dont-blame-gillard-labors-nadir-has-been-a-team-effort-20120502-1xz5d.html#ixzz1tmsMWXG6

  8. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:03 pm

    Meta, the reason the opposition can fly under the radar like this is that the public doesn’t care any more. Every day the government is force-feeding them a shit sandwich and they just want it to stop.

    The people know that parliament is being debased, that the government is propped up by crooks and it stinks to high heaven. They now understand that the Carbon Tax lie was not an isolated thing. They know that this government will do anything, absolutely anything, to hang on to power. Nothing short of a good cleansing at the polls will do.

    Given Labor’s willingness to do support Thomson financially and protect him politically it seems a fair conclusion that it was no accident that some one like Williamson could be president of the party.

    The government has lost legitimacy. There is absolutely nothing it can do to get it back now. It just needs to be put out of its misery.

    Sadly I don’t think the other lot will be much better in terms of competence. But at least they should not be as grotesquely grubby as this lot, if for no other reason than that they will have a large enough majority to be able to stand up to crooks and grubs and get rid of them instead of buying their support and becoming one with their rottenness, as Labor has done.

    Look, I’m an equal opportunity hater, but the thing I hate most right now is to wake up every day and see that the government this country is in the hands of a pack of power-crazed mongrels rolling around in their own shit. And every day it gets worse. I don’t care any more about their policies. I don’t care what’s in the budget or about the disability scheme – even the Mafia helped the poor people in their community. I just want these bastards out of office. They can’t be allowed to get away with this debauch of our democracy..

  9. el gordo permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:11 pm

    It will be a financial disaster for Australia if Julia remains in power beyond June.

  10. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:16 pm

    Look, I’m an equal opportunity hater, but the thing I hate most right now is to wake up every day and see that the government this country is in the hands of a pack of power-crazed mongrels rolling around in their own shit. And every day it gets worse. I don’t care any more about their policies. I don’t care what’s in the budget or about the disability scheme – even the Mafia helped the poor people in their community. I just want these bastards out of office. They can’t be allowed to get away with this debauch of our democracy..

    … I tend to agree … but nothing will change with a change of government … except … wall to wall LNP corruption across the states … with absolute power corrupting absolutely … should the ALP have a terminal illness as most of us suspect … then what we end up with is a “virtual” dictatorship across Australia …

    … democracy is dying across the Western world … our political and economic system is no better than the failed socialism of Russia where corruption and greed STILL abound …

    … the RICH still trying to get RICHER and the POOR still PAYING the PRICE …

    … no wonder there was the beginnings of revolution in Brixstone, UK!

    Where next? South Yarra?

  11. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:17 pm

    … I tend to agree … but nothing will change with a change of government … except … wall to wall LNP corruption across the states … with absolute power corrupting absolutely … should the ALP have a terminal illness as most of us suspect … then what we end up with is a “virtual” dictatorship across Australia …

    … democracy is dying across the Western world … our political and economic system is no better than the failed socialism of Russia where corruption and greed STILL abound …

    … the RICH still trying to get RICHER and the POOR still PAYING the PRICE …

    … no wonder there was the beginnings of revolution in Brixstone, UK!

    Where next? South Yarra?

  12. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:19 pm

    It will be a financial disaster for Australia if Julia remains in power beyond June.

    Yep, bring on Hockey and Andrews … they’ll sort it out … 🙄

    FMD! egg!

  13. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:21 pm

    The Carbon Tax … BOO!

  14. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:37 pm

    “nothing will change with a change of government”

    At the very least Thomson and Slipper will no longer walk the corridors of power.

    With any luck there will be a wide-ranging Royal Commission into the Unionland quagmire starting with the HSU and then moving quickly to the AWU.

    Union officials need to be made more accountable to their members the way public company directors are accountable to their shareholders.

    Plus the ALP might actually try to reform itself, even distance itself from Unionland. If not they will not govern for a very long time. If the unions lose their votes at ALP conferences then they won’t be able to install crooked union officials in parliament. Williamson will not be able to try to buy-off Jackson with a seat in parliament. The factions will be greatly weakened.

    Look at it this way, after Whitlam suffered the judgement of the people, the execrable Malcolm Fraser won three elections. That is the minimum Labor is looking at even if Hockey is treasurer all that time.

  15. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:50 pm

    Union officials need to be made more accountable to their members the way public company directors are accountable to their shareholders.

    Does that include … Christopher Skase, Alan Bond, Eddie Groves et al?

    I’m sorry but your attempt at bi-partisan posting … coupled with the vitriolic and objectionable adjectives and your obvious misunderstanding or abandonment (and/or ignorance) of legal due process … doesn’t give it much credence …

    … I don’t like what is happening within some unions and I agree accountability needs to be of ‘corporate” standards … (in fact during my career I disliked many of the senior union people I met as a rep, manager and consultant but I saw them as a “necessary evil” to counter the Robber Baron attitude and approach to many employees …

    To quote from the Paul Sheehan article above …

    Gillard benefited from their treachery, but she did not create it.

    … and this …

    Just because Gillard, as Prime Minister, has been unable to break her droning monotone, her leaden diction, and her endless references to ”working Australians” does not mean she deserves the avalanche of opprobrium she now receives.

  16. Meta permalink
    May 3, 2012 6:54 pm

    (Oops, it was remiss of me to almost overlook Christine Milne’s contributions to public discussions in all the finality of 2PP accountings; recently, her/the Greens views on Budgets, muckrakings, etc; and, for some froth, the upcoming opportunity to hear her in Melbourne at the Beer and Brewery Industry Conference.)

  17. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2012 7:01 pm

    One of the construction unions (allegedly) has links with one of the ‘illegal bikie gangs’

    Really there is plenty of juicy stuff for political mileage for a new government. It’s not limited to the HSU.

    I’m off for plenty of shiraz.

  18. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2012 7:20 pm

    Jesus, TB, I wonder if you get the seriousness of just what is going on. If this Government doesn’t get out soon what we WILL have is close to a dictatorship, and whilst it’s no secret that I dont much like Labor, I like a dictatorship less (unless I’m the dictator).

    Williamson was the ALP President. Now you can’t tell me that there aren’t a whole bunch of people who well knew, or at least suspected what was going on with the HSU. They’ve known for at least 4 years in any event. And they’ve done SFA to sort it out. As late as last week you had Shorten trying to manufacture the latest cover up.

    My concern is that this runs deeper than we realise. I’ve had concerns about the reporting standards of Industry Super Funds for a long time now as you well know. Not until now, though, did I have concerns that there might be actual serious rorting of the schemes. My concerns more related to picking winners as far as investments were concerned and trade unions controlling the markets. Now if the standard that Williamson has set is more widespread, and I fear it is given the inaction of Labor people to right a pretty obvious wrong, then there are many millions of workers’ funds that could have gone anywhere. Billions in fact. We’ll know in time.

    The upshot of this is that Labor will be completely wiped out if this goes any longer. It’ll be worse than Qld. Now as partisan as one might be, no-one wants that in a democracy. There’s got to be someone on the opposite benches asking some questions.

    Carbon Tax BOO? Just what is the Carbon Tax? It certainly isn’t a cog in a worldwide cooperative scheme to reduce CO2 emissions and stop the Earth heating. The Earth’s not heating and there isn’t even close to a worldwide scheme? I’m thinking of pantswetting here and suggesting it might be a scheme to cream further money out of the economy and line the pockets of these filthy cnts.

    Just over a year ago I was in hospital with Mrs Sancty and I was quite aware of these poor bloody hospital workers. Barely any of them spoke English and their jobs were absolute shit. And they get paid sweet fuck all. I actually nearly gave one poor old bastard a heart attack when I smiled and said G’day and started talking to him in broken Italian. Out of that sweet fuck all they have to pay the HSU $300 odd for what? My footy club membership is about that and I get a measureable benefit. Same with my yacht club membership. On both counts I get serious representation on matters important to me. I know this because I also do the representing. Has anyone ever actually heard of the HSU out there getting a better deal for their workers?

    I’m sorry, this is a bit of a rant but it makes my blood boil.

    And the fact that they are still covering it up, denying it, and all the rest. They could have walked away years ago when the game was up. They could have quietly cleaned up the mess and slunk off in embarrassment. But they were so bloody cocksure and entitled that they’ve continued to string it out and fight for their right to continue the rip off and they still fucking do. And why were they cocksure? Because of their enablers. And why were they so enabled?

    THAT remains the BIG question.

    I don’t care what you think about Abbott, Howard, Costello, Hockey, Pyne, Murdoch, Palmer or whoever. None of them are even on the same ballpark as this mob when it comes to criminal bastardry.

  19. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2012 7:22 pm

    TB, Skase and Bond were criminals and Eddie is looking over his shoulder now as ASIC and the DPP close in.

    What don’t I get about due process exactly? Suppose we assume Craig Thomson gets off because he was entitled to use his card to buy whores. The fact that he is not convicted would not change my view of him one bit. It is not about the presumption of innocence. It is about making a judgment about his character and fitness to serve in Federal parliament. The fact that very credible evidence has been presented and he long ago promised a detailed explanation and hasn’t delivered it is enough for me.

    The vitriolic language is just an expression of how angry I am at the way this government is behaving.

    I’m glad we agree in corporate standards for unions.

    “Just because Gillard, as Prime Minister, has been unable to break her droning monotone, her leaden diction, and her endless references to ”working Australians” does not mean she deserves the avalanche of opprobrium she now receives.”

    I agree completely. But what kind of stupid straw man argument is that?

    In fact, she deserves the avalanche of opprobrium she now receives because she is not trusted at all by anyone, because of her words and actions. Because she broke her promise on the carbon tax and because she betrayed Wilkie and because she so often expressed support for Thomosn and because she sacked Harry Evans and installed Peter Slipper in a move of cold-blooded expediency and because she stabbed Kevin Rudd and then blamed him for dropping the ETS and mining tax after advising him to do exactly that and because she couldn’t give a straight answer on Four Corners and appeared for all the world to be lying and because no one has been able to see through all the spin work out who the real Julia is – the Socialis Forum, Emily’s Lister or the anti-marriage equality, teach the bible in schools proponent. She doesn’t seem to understand that there are limits to spin and if you cross them you stand exposed as the devious manipulator of the truth that you actually are.

    Her “a line has been crossed” speech is classic. It is completely illogical. She wouldn’t actually say what that line was. No wonder the press replayed and mocked it! It was an incoherent attempt to justify her sudden change of attitude. She needed to say things that are credible, that add up and make sense to people. But now its a case of the people knowing that she can’t give a direct answer, that she tries to spin everything and we can’t trust a word she says. As Richo said – the mob will always work you out. Well they’ve worked out Julia Gillard and the rest of her rat-pack.

    Her problem isn’t her diction – it is her dicking-around of the people of Australia. She’s done it too often, the people have seen through her and there is absolutely no possibility now of people trusting her again.

  20. el gordo permalink
    May 3, 2012 7:31 pm

    FMD! egg!

    I want a change in Labor leader so that we can save the party.

  21. Meta permalink
    May 3, 2012 8:12 pm

    (Still can’t be Smith: he’s said to be considering shrinking the growing military entitlements formerly guaranteed by Marshall Howard; unresisting cutting and running early in the 100-year Afghanistan War; and complicit in Juliar’s bringing forward the TippEx on the BRACish/lily-paddish Defence Whitepaper: no thanks to Smith, the Barbarians are at the gate, I’m afraid.)

  22. Tony permalink
    May 3, 2012 9:23 pm

    Nice diatribes by James and Splatter. 😯 😉

  23. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2012 9:29 pm

    Inspired by Hildebrandt. Did you see his rant last week?

  24. Tony permalink
    May 3, 2012 9:37 pm

    Nope. Gotta link?

  25. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2012 9:43 pm

    Try this.

    Sent from my iPhone

  26. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2012 10:00 pm

    One more thing… If this turns out as I think it is going to, that Kathy Jackson deserves a bravery award. There will be a movie about her.

  27. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 3, 2012 10:19 pm

    Kathy Jackson was interviewed on 2GB last night and she claimed that Craig Thomson was a pathological liar.

    I was surprised at the strong language and I think you can be sued for saying something like that but that is what she said.

  28. Tony permalink
    May 3, 2012 10:36 pm

    Anyway, fuck what Hildebrandt thinks. More importantly, what do TomR and Bacchus think? 😉

  29. public toilet permalink
    May 3, 2012 11:09 pm

    Squirt, squirt…go the Abbotteers.

  30. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2012 11:56 pm

    “I was surprised at the strong language and I think you can be sued for saying something like that but that is what she said.”

    In the Fairfax case the alleged defamation included that Thomson was unfit to be a member of parliament. Given that he declined to give evidence to the contrary in that case, the general view is that he is undefamable, especially since truth is a defence in NSW. I suspect Jackson would have little trouble making out her case, and I doubt Thomson would actually subject himself to cross examination for precisely the reason Jackson states.

    No doubt Labor will treat Jackson in the same disgusting way they treated Gillian Sneddon* (who proved that one honest citizen has more decency than the entire Labor party combined). I hope Jackson has the fortitude to deal with the those evil fuckers who are trying to maintain the status quo. Australia needs people like her a whole lot more than they need the fucking Labor party and its army of arse-licking trolls.

    And don’t even bother telling me that my screed is vitriolic, TB. Whatever it is, it is a whole lot better than anything that oozes from the ALP these days. Go on. Tell me that Gillian Sneddon deserved to be treated the way she was by the party, or that the Botany aldermen deserved to have their lives destroyed for exposing Labor bribery and corruption. And while you are at it tell me how lucky I am to be living in a state which had such a long period of Labor rule, especially from the likes of the selfless Obeid and Tripodi clans. For so long as people go on making excuses for them, saying that the other guys are just as bad, the ALP will not get better. The same old tribalistic factionalism will stay strong and the party will be as corrupt as ever. Then again, if you think this fuss is all because of Gillard’s diction, just send her to elocution classes and everything will be fine, won’t it?

    * Sneddon blew the whistle on the drug pushing child molester and Labor parliamentarian Milton Orkopoulos.

  31. May 4, 2012 12:49 am

    “For so long as people go on making excuses for them, saying that the other guys are just as bad, the ALP will not get better.”

    Strongly agree.

    But the other guys are just as bad…& possibly more exploitative of stoopidheads.

  32. Meta permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:06 am

    (CAV on zero-sum statements tending towards Manichaeism.)

  33. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 9:27 am

    Greg Sheridan (Behind Paywall) in the Oz today presumably banging on about Budget cuts.

    “THIS is the worst day for Australia’s national security since the fall of Saigon in 1975………………”

    Not being willing to pay for the Oz I’m wondering what he’s banging on about.

    Was the Australian Mainland once under seige by the Vietnamese ?

    Were our maritime trade routes once cut off by the mighty Vietnamese Navy ?

    Were Vietnamese Paratroopers dropped over Fairfield/Cabrammatta or Footscray or secretly planted as “sleepers” operating Pho Soup stalls and restaurants?

    Can someone tell me what he finds troubling about a Vietnamese Pork Roll.

    Now that I have managed to make myself feel hungry is that in itself the act of a traitor ?

  34. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 9:30 am

    Good to see Barry O’Farrell about to give Shorten a run for his money. O’Farrell wants the Court to appoint his choice of Administrator not Shorten’s .

    After all the HSU East is incorporated in NSW therefore the fight will be over who has proper jurisdiction.

    The Feds or the States

  35. May 4, 2012 9:53 am

    Pho Soup yum…!

  36. Bacchus permalink
    May 4, 2012 9:56 am

    Put that sentence into google Jaws – you may be amazed at what you can then read from the link that’s returned 😉

  37. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 10:32 am

    Following on from jaws (foreign affairs) they are talking about a window of opportunity for our enemies.

    ‘The best time to invade Australia will be around 2028-30,” says Professor Alan Dupont, director of the Institute for International Security and Development at the University of NSW and a former analyst with the Defence Department.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/federal-budget/dear-foes-invade-us-in-2028-20120503-1y1vl.html#ixzz1tr9QooRd

  38. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 10:32 am

    Thanks Bacchus I did………

    So what’s the diff ?

    Is he therefore implying our Military under Howard would have been able to resist the Chinese Peoples Army ?

    I’ll take my chances with the Pho Soup man ………………

    I’m sure the ADF long after I’m gone will still prefer the Pho Soup man as well

  39. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 10:34 am

    ‘The best time to invade Australia will be around 2028-30,”

    They wont have to

    By then most of Queensland and WA would have been shipped over there anyway

  40. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 10:36 am

    🙂

  41. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 11:26 am

    I suppose it just goes to show that Swan has managed to piss so much cash up against the Wall in sheer waste that now the consequences are reflected in all these cuts .

  42. May 4, 2012 11:32 am

    Sherridan has always been a conservative squirter of no small water when it comes to foreign affairs.

    I’d take anything he pens for the partisan tosh that it is.

    He’s probably gonna give snacty nightmares with such talk of invasion. After all, that pump is well & truly primed.

  43. Bacchus permalink
    May 4, 2012 11:33 am

    So what’s the diff ?

    You can read whatever is behind the paywall using the google technique. This tip comes to you courtesy of CU at the Café…

    http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=&q=Response+to+national+security+is+in+la-la+land+&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B7GGHP_en-GBAU433AU406&ie=UTF-8

  44. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 11:34 am

    I’m totally sick of it all now. Tired of the vitriol and nastiness that we have had ever since rudd labor came to office. Totally turned off by it all.

    The only bright spot in these bleak times have been the greens with their positivism and their principled and honest politics. The other two majors behaviour have had the effect of showing the greens as being above the stinking sewer that the two majors are swimming in.

    …and many Labor MPs must be seriously considering their own prospects as well as their leader’s ability to reverse the party’s fortunes.

    To my mind, many labor MP’s should be seriously considering their own part in labor’s misfortunes, it’s not all down to JG, there is supposed to be team and from what I’ve seen they are not very competent. I haven’t seen too many in front of the cameras spruiking labor’s performance and needling abbott’s opposition. That’s the problem, Gillard is left with the support of those who stabbed Rudd and they are not up to the task, while the good ones walked out in disgust – tanner, faulkner etc. Some exceptions have been emerson, albanese, roxon, pilbersek and combet but there are some underachievers like macklin, ludwig et al who don’t deserve their positions.

    I don’t know why, but labor should have found a way to get abbott on the back foot, even if they had to get down to his grubby political level to do so.

    …I don’t care what you think about Abbott, Howard, Costello, Hockey, Pyne, Murdoch, Palmer or whoever. None of them are even on the same ballpark as this mob when it comes to criminal bastardry.

    BS, they are all that and worse.

    One more thing… If this turns out as I think it is going to, that Kathy Jackson deserves a bravery award. There will be a movie about her.

    Since when is self interest, bomb throwing and destruction of the entire place for the benefit of the enemy, the same as bravery. Now, if she was not going to end up with a financial or career reward, you might be right.

  45. May 4, 2012 11:35 am

    Thanks, bacchus (& CU)! 🙂

    I’d rather eat shaved glass than pay to read their tripe. Haven’t looked there for an eternity for that very reason.

    Does the same apply to Herr Bolt’s ‘hidden’ congealments?

  46. Bacchus permalink
    May 4, 2012 11:38 am

    Don’t know HD – I haven’t looked there for other reasons 😉

  47. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 11:40 am

    I’d rather eat shaved glass than pay to read their tripe

    me too, where’s our version of a leverson inquiry?

  48. May 4, 2012 11:44 am

    As evidenced by histrionics from plenty of otherwise rational people, the opposing base has been whipped into a frenzy over the current government.

    I think the ALP is dismal, but nowhere near the depths that squirter hyperbole infers. They are bad, but its hardly the life threatening, country destroying disaster that the clamour makes it out to be.

    It’s worth noting that the reflexive disgust with the ALP began in earnest the day they ousted Howard & has built in momentum every day since through both polemic campaigning & the government’s own missteps.
    The gargoyles hated Rudd like he was Stalin & didn’t skip a beat transferring their hatred to Gillard. I’m quite sure that if Gillard was replaced they’d just shift aim to the next target without any sort of diminishing of their indignance.

    In a way, I understand. I was absolutely repulsed by nearly everything Howard did (& still loathe the wizened insect)…but, it’s a partisan reaction in many ways…& the rhetoric doesn’t intersect with the reality often times.

    I think having a squirt is cathartic for them.

  49. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 11:48 am

    Goodness, defence budget stripped of 4billion – they are having a meltdown at the oz!

    squirt, it’s running down their legs, not defence FGS, the untouchables!

    While labor’s about it how about a cleanup of ASIO too.

  50. May 4, 2012 11:49 am

    Imagine taking your cues from the likes of Andrew Arsehat, Piers, Miranda, Gerard, Janet & the rest of the rightard cavalcade!

    If that don’t beat all. 🙄

  51. May 4, 2012 11:51 am

    “I haven’t looked there for other reasons”

    Because he’s patently full of shit? 😉

  52. May 4, 2012 11:54 am

    “Imagine taking your cues from the likes of Andrew Arsehat, Piers, Miranda, Gerard, Janet & the rest of the rightard cavalcade!”

    Eeew! It doesn’t bear thinking about… Not to mention Anal Jones.

  53. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:01 pm

    I think the ALP is dismal, but nowhere near the depths that squirter hyperbole infers. They are bad, but its hardly the life threatening, country destroying disaster that the clamour makes it out to be.

    When it comes down to it labor have been achieving, quietly making and implementing policies. The only thing abbott has done is badmouth and attack on a personal level and perform the usual coalition dirt politics of exposing private bedroom antics and bribery for sleaze.

    Remember heffernan and michael kirby, BTW whatever happened to bill heffernan, I hope he’s not still an MP after all his slanderous slurs, what did the Libs do about that?

  54. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:05 pm

    “Since when is self interest, bomb throwing and destruction of the entire place for the benefit of the enemy, the same as bravery.”

    That is a deeply troubling statement, Armie.

    Since when has calling in the police to deal with corruption on a massive scale been anathema to Labor? Jackson did the right thing whereas the ALP has done its level best to protect the crooks and sweep this all under the carpet. This corrosive attitude is at the heart of the problem.

    It seems that anyone who exposes the festering rottenness in Unionland is immediately the enemy and the cry goes out – “Burn the Witch”.

  55. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:08 pm

    I object, Toilet. I did pause when Rudd got booted. For quite some time in fact. I don’t think I started in on JG personally until the broken promise on the CT. I might be wrong, it might have been earlier but I certainly stayed silent for a good period because I was happy to see Rudd booted.

    How wrong I was.

  56. May 4, 2012 12:18 pm

    C’mon, snacty, you guys love hating on the official shitlist! 😉

    * my comments were meant in a very general sense, not aimed at any specific individuals.

    ** I do think that the anti-government sentiment is overblown & exaggerated.

    *** I don’t doubt that the ALP is heading for an electoral decimation.

    **** The Sydney Handbagz are going to … this weekend.

  57. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:20 pm

    It seems that anyone who exposes the festering rottenness in Unionland is immediately the enemy and the cry goes out – “Burn the Witch”.

    She could have been a real whistleblower by not having her legal fees funded by a Coalition partner. Could have made her claims and defended them publicly in an ethical manner along the lines of andrew wilkie. Her own behaviour should have been above suspicion as well, not personally benefiting from the largesse for years and then ‘coming out’ as a turncoat when your new political friends promise rewards for your traitory. Some people can be bought and some can’t, that’s the difference between jackson and wilkie.

  58. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:31 pm

    Kittylitter, your stated position on Jackson simply staggers me. As much as I generally disagree with you, I do believe that as wrong as you are, your positions are genuinely heartfelt, and I know that sounds patronising but I can’t express it any other way.

    You know these workers. You work alongside them. You must by now know the extent of the skimming by Williamson etc. I know there are allegations about Jackson, and I know which camp they are coming from. I am therefore very doubtful about them. Who cares who pays her legal fees? I understand the lawyers are acting pro bono and the alternatives were all conflicted out. What was she to do? Self represent? Much as I admire her she is no advocate.

  59. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:42 pm

    You know these workers. You work alongside them. You must by now know the extent of the skimming by Williamson etc.

    I’m not defending the union or thomson, the practices needed to be exposed and it could have been done with restructuring and financial accountability from the inside. Kathy jackson is embroiled in a power struggle for personal control of her own. She no more has the union of workers at heart than wilkinson or thomson did. That is why I say that they all need to go and the union appoint a new executive. Kathy jackson has never worked in the health industry. The membership is leaving in droves.

    You lot keep saying that unions need to operate along the lines of the corporate world, well is that the new corporatism – promotion when you preside over complete destruction, scandal and shareholder desertion?

  60. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:49 pm

    Who cares who pays her legal fees?

    It makes a HUGE difference regarding her loyalties, motivation, inducements, honesty plus personal principles and integrity. Same for ashby.

    If someone else is paying mega bucks for you, what is in it for them and what are they asking of you?

  61. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:51 pm

    “You lot keep saying that unions need to operate along the lines of the corporate world”

    Not so.

    What I did say is that union officials should be held to the same standard of conduct as public company directors and be subject to the same fiduciary duties. They should disclose all benefits they receive. Even TB agreed with this.

  62. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:53 pm

    I’m totally sick of it all now. Tired of the vitriol and nastiness that we have had ever since rudd labor came to office. Totally turned off by it all.”

    I saw many nasty comments and allegations against Howard on Tim Dunops blog. Calling Howard a mass murderer was common practice on Blogocracy. The nastiness did not start when Labor came into power. Conservatives do not hate like the left does.

    Pointing out that Gillard is a liar is not nasty, it is the truth.

    Ask Wilkie. You cannot get much lower than break a written agreement

  63. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:53 pm

    Who cares who pays her legal fees?

    And she is beholden to them [which puts everything she does and says under a cloud of suspicion] she is not her own person any longer.

  64. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 12:59 pm

    Not so.
    What I did say is that union officials should be held to the same standard of conduct as public company directors and be subject to the same fiduciary duties. They should disclose all benefits they receive. Even TB agreed with this.

    Oh, so pick and choose only the bits you like about your argument, ignore the realities, the inconsistencies and contradictions following on from your stance?.

  65. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:05 pm

    Who cares who pays her legal fees?

    Oh james, you are a budding lawyer and you say that? C’mon now 😆

  66. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:13 pm

    “It makes a HUGE difference regarding her loyalties, motivation, inducements, honesty plus personal principles and integrity.”

    Let’s assume all that is true. Even so, her going to the police was unquestionably the right thing to do. She is to be commended for that, not vilified by every Labor shill in the country.

  67. May 4, 2012 1:13 pm

    “Conservatives do not hate like the left does.”

    What utter crap!

    Word for word, a regurgitation of a Boltian mantra.

    I have no inclination to do so, nor the time, but it would be very easy to harvest rightwing blogs & produce a torrent of evidence of rightard hatred.

    Single minded ignorance isn’t ideologically specific.

  68. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:22 pm

    ‘The only bright spot in these bleak times have been the greens with their positivism and their principled and honest politics.’

    Watermelons are pathetic.

  69. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:26 pm

    “Oh, so pick and choose only the bits you like about your argument, ignore the realities, the inconsistencies and contradictions following on from your stance?.”

    WTF???

    I merely told you, again, what my argument was. Because you incorrectly said it was something else.

    If you had actually thought about my argument the first time I explained it you would not be making shit up.

    It went like this:

    1. Public company directors are in a relationship of trust with their shareholders.

    2.To protect the shareholders the law imposes fiduciary and other duties on directors.

    3.The law also requires public disclosure of all benefits directors receive from the company.

    4. Senior union officials are in a similar relationship of trust with their members.

    5. Accordingly they should have imposed on them similar obligations.

    This is a proposition limited to the duties and obligations that should be imposed on union officials. It is not a general suggestion that they operate along the lines of the corporate world (whatever that means).

    However, adopting that proposition would go a long way towards stopping unions operating along the lines of the Mafia, which some of them seem to do.

  70. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:32 pm

    ‘I’m quite sure that if Gillard was replaced they’d just shift aim to the next target without any sort of diminishing of their indignance.’

    Not straight off, there would be a honeymoon period to see what he’s going to do. The Bolter said they should change leaders, for the sake of the Westminster system, but that pernicious tax on a harmless gas will have to be lifted.

  71. May 4, 2012 1:39 pm

    Seal yourself in a confined space, have the oxygen evacuated & carbon dioxide pumped in…if you weren’t dead after that you’d be able to retract the non-sensical claim about CO2.

  72. May 4, 2012 1:40 pm

    That’s not to say that I don’t recognise the folly of the tax on it. 😉

  73. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:40 pm

    ‘The Tasmanian Greens have chosen winemaker, academic and former investment banker Peter Whish-Wilson to replace Bob Brown in the Senate.’

  74. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:44 pm

    Sorry toilet, discussions on the odious subject of an odourless gas is forbidden on this thread.

  75. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 1:56 pm

    So what exactly is wrong with greater disclosure requirements for Unions ?

    Surely members have a right to seee details of how their funds are spent each year and ranges of the remuneration of the top officials.

    FFS even Registered Clubs have to do it.

    Why cant I as a member see that someone at the top of the HSU is earning $300K plus.

    WTF is wrong with that ?

    Why are members not at least entitled to see the top 10 expense items of the Union ?

    Unions are quick to condemn execs in the private sector. If they have nothing to hide themselves then they can f**king well disclose their own info as well.

    Until then from now on people will laugh when a Union boss criticizes a Bank CEO based on information PUBLICLY required by Law

  76. May 4, 2012 2:07 pm

    Feisty little bunch of peeps we are today aren’t we…? 😉

  77. May 4, 2012 2:28 pm

    MUA here to stay!

  78. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 2:43 pm

    “Feisty little bunch”

    Just venting a little bit. It is about all I can do, waking up every day to the same nightmare.

    How is Melbourne today?

  79. May 4, 2012 3:05 pm

    Not bad SB… Quite mild, not as chilly as the other day…

  80. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2012 3:14 pm

    Seal yourself in a confined space, have the oxygen evacuated & carbon dioxide pumped in…if you weren’t dead after that you’d be able to retract the non-sensical claim about CO2.

    Swap CO2 and oxygen around and the result would in time be the same.

  81. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 3:36 pm

    Is Melbourne weather much different to Hobart?

    Sydney is sunny today. I’ve got some reggae playing in the office, winding down for the weekend. Interestingly the reggae is from Mauritius – a guy in the office comes from there.

  82. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2012 3:40 pm

    SB certainly has a way with words, quite accurate too. This government stinks and people know it.

    AO provides an accurate insight to the thinking of someone with genuine leftist credentials and orientation. But she’ll have to excuse those of us who are particularly cynical. Rudd had set himself too high a hurdle for transparency, he was never going to live up to it (particularly while surrounded by ALP hacks).

    Gillard was always going to be a dud, any cursory look at her policy history will show that. Past failure in policy is a fair indicator of future policy failure.

    The ALP stench has caused the entirely unappealing prospect of the Liberal Party winning big time, and decimating the next generation of ALP MPs.

    The stench is all about tricky politics, too clever, too interested in the game of politics and totally uninterested in the orientation of the public. But the best the ALP can come up with – ”Where’s the evidence? There’s no prosecution!” “That Liberal Senator got caught shoplifting!”

    On this standard, they’d never have discussed –
    • children overboard (no prosecution),
    • AWB (no prosecution), Iraq invasion (no prosecution),
    • Workchoices (where’s the evidence of all the allegations?)

  83. May 4, 2012 4:26 pm

    Sorry, snacty, but I don’t need remedial science lessons.

    I’m sure that you’re not suggesting that I’m unaware of the fundamentals of respiration.

    That moronbyte about CO2 being ‘harmless’ is just derivative claptrap.

  84. May 4, 2012 4:30 pm

    “Is Melbourne weather much different to Hobart?”

    It’s a few degrees warmer…

  85. Bacchus permalink
    May 4, 2012 4:35 pm

    Well at this rate, Mr Thompson should only have to wait another 8 years to be charged, and then, if he pleads guilty, expect a 6 day suspended jail term and a $96 fine 😆

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-05-04/former-wheat-board-executive-fine-for-fraud/3991548

  86. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 4:46 pm

    Gee Bacchus

    Unlike you to only provide part of the story LOL.

    It seems some did go to the Big House

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/businessold/jail-for-trade-fraud/story-e6frfh4f-1111112575140

  87. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 4:48 pm

    Thompson will get more than a fine if he’s been taking secret commissions.

    He’ll see plenty of action in the shower block with the “Gorillas in the Mist”

  88. May 4, 2012 4:49 pm

    Yeah, the middle of the range anons make great scapegoats & protect the likes of Downer. 🙄

    What a huge surprise.

  89. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 4, 2012 4:52 pm

    But she’ll have to excuse those of us who are particularly cynical.

    It’s OK to be cynical, it’s the one-eyed cynicism where you can’t acknowledge the same behaviour in your own side and the ‘snot-nose in the air’ pretence that ‘your side’ is not as bad as the other!

    Unions=BOO and they must be destroyed, but corporate malfeasance, collusion, corruption and predatory practice go unnoticed or accepted as routine business procedure. can’t see that unions are just the opposite side of the coin to business and they have a legitimate role in society and the workplace to protect workers from the might and power of an unfettered market.

    I find a failure to be objective and balanced in the thinking and reasoning of the wingnuts and a failure to acknowledge that others are more idealistic and may want something better than their alternative ‘choice’ of government. To people like me, they are equally as bad, if not worse because of their hatreds, their racism, prejudice and biased views [and the sleazy mudgrubbing style of politics that their side practise].

    I want better quality, they don’t come cheap and we as taxpayers fund this garbage, we are not being served well by the quality and calibre of politicians and media in this country.

  90. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 4:54 pm

    “Condon was handed a two year jail sentence, wholly suspended, due to the delay in the case.”

    How does that work? I could understand if he had been held without bail all this time. Two years seems pretty light for what he did, but suspending the sentence is crazy.

  91. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 5:14 pm

    “………….unions are just the opposite side of the coin to business and they have a legitimate role in society and the workplace to protect workers from the might and power of an unfettered market.”

    “unfettered market”………………?

    How about protecting the workers from unfettered use of union credit cards before you concern yourself about the market first.

    Oh……..that’s right I forgot………………………..Business = BOO

  92. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 5:24 pm

    WOW………………………

    Cancel that weekend away………………….

    Cancel your restaurant bookings for tonight……………………..

    In fact……………………..cancel them tomorrow night as well.

    Make yourself a cup of tea and put your feet up as I’ve got something really special for you to read and it will take all weekend

    Enjoy yourself

    http://agencysearch.australia.gov.au/search/search.cgi?collection=agencies&profile=asic&scope_disable=off&num_ranks=20&stem=2&query=bustan&x=10&y=7

  93. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 5:40 pm

    Yeah

    No one in the Corporate World ever ever gets to go to the Big House.

    Corporate Execs get away with everything without impunity goes the usual Leftwing Nutjob line…………………..

    As usual they are wrong

    http://www.westpointinvestorsgroup.com/Royal_Commission/2008_02_29_Mayne%20Report.pdf

  94. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 5:50 pm

    ” it’s the one-eyed cynicism”

    Like this, perhaps:

    “I find a failure to be objective and balanced in the thinking and reasoning of the wingnuts and a failure to acknowledge that others are more idealistic and may want something better than their alternative ‘choice’ of government. To people like me, they are equally as bad, if not worse because of their hatreds, their racism, prejudice and biased views [and the sleazy mudgrubbing style of politics that their side practise].”

    Do you actually even believe that?

  95. JAWS permalink
    May 4, 2012 5:58 pm

    Of course she does

  96. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2012 6:07 pm

    Just dropped in and saw this …

    It’s a few degrees warmer…

    LOL! What’s the difference between -2℃ and 2℃ … answer –

    I shall now peruse the thread for further humour …

  97. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2012 6:41 pm

    Who cares who pays her legal fees?

    You and others had concerns that the ALP paid Craig Thomson’s fees ($100,000 I believe) – much more than the pro bono for Jackson (just another pig at the trough) will be … @ $10,000 + per day …) double standards are not befitting of a wannabe lawyer, James , even though it seems to be the “norm” …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Even TB agreed with this

    … and I do … everyone should be accountable if they choose to have an affect on other people’s lives … The Opposition Leader too … and posters on blogs who actually write BS knowing it is BS …

    … and I’m not quite sure what … even TB… means … good? or bad?

    … strangely my posts come across to some died in the wool ALP barrackers, as “sneaky right wing spy” and to rusted on LNP barrackers, as a “rusted on ALP poster” … they are both wrong …

    For those who don’t know me … old hands skip now …

    … my upbringing (Mum Liberal, Dad Labor) and adult education (trade, H&S diploma, business degree) and work/life experience (immigrant at 12, a Dad at 21, Granda at 44, – two kids five g/kids, National Service at 22, trade, supervisor, manager, consultant, small business owner) , colours my judgement of things political and business …

    … and while I’m not a swinging voter I do believe in justice, fairness and people using all the faculties they were born with … I recognise that there are people much more intellectually capable and skillful than me and I recognise that there are others who are not …

    … just as there are people more manually skilled than I am … and there are people who need help to survive and those who simply bludge on the system …

    … having been through the process of immigrant with my parents (and the nonsense of Citizenship @ 26 having served my two years NS) I have a lot of sympathy for asylum seekers … however, I don’t for young men from countries our young men are fighting and dying in … (ie any male between the ages of 18 and 40 from Afghanistan should be immediately sent back to fight or be trained to fight their own war or when we leave!) …

    My weakness … I hate liars … blame me Mum … however I will apologise for mistakes I make …

  98. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2012 6:48 pm

    By the way, I should reply to AO – the Liberals are the party they’ve always been. My expectations of them don’t change.

    The ALP on the other hand have made such mileage out of transparency, ethics, care for underprivileged people (such as single parents)

    There is no similarity between the progressive ALP narrative of opposition, and the practice they adopt in government.

  99. May 4, 2012 6:55 pm

    “… strangely my posts come across to some died in the wool ALP barrackers, as “sneaky right wing spy” and to rusted on LNP barrackers, as a “rusted on ALP poster” … they are both wrong … ”

    It’s the nature of words upon a screen,TB. What you’re actually saying gets lost amongst the confirmation bias of others.

  100. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 7:03 pm

    “… and I’m not quite sure what … even TB… means … good? or bad?”

    Definitely not bad. Just trying to shore up my argument by referring to an elder statesman who Armie might respect a bit more than me.

    TB, don’t take me wrong here. I’m a bit volatile, but I value frank discussion.

  101. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 7:10 pm

    ‘…lost amongst the confirmation bias of others.’

    I’ll pay that.

  102. May 4, 2012 7:12 pm

    “By the way, I should reply to AO – the Liberals are the party they’ve always been. My expectations of them don’t change.”

    I think that’s a fair comment..

    Everyone knows that the Liberals are a pack of nasty conservative self-serving cnuts…

    The only difference is that Labor pretended that they weren’t.

    How foolish do we all look now…?

  103. May 4, 2012 7:21 pm

    To the frank discussion, I mean.

    I’m not in the habit of highfiving myself. 😯

  104. May 4, 2012 7:22 pm

    I think you only look foolish if you continue to refuse to recognise the blatantly obvious.

    Having ideals & entrusting them to flags, figureheads or ‘Partys’ is fraught.

  105. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 4, 2012 7:37 pm

    “Having ideals & entrusting them to flags, figureheads or ‘Partys’ is fraught.”

    The truth.

    The biggest mistake is to take sides.

  106. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2012 7:48 pm

    ‘The biggest mistake is to take sides.’

    True, it eventually leads to remorse as the pendulum swings. The ‘rusted ons’ will fight bravely to the end, but to no avail, the free thinking greater middle class will vote for what’s in their best interest.

  107. James of North Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2012 10:03 pm

    Notice the old “wannabe lawyer” thing has had a couple of runs tonight. Shows just how little you two know about the law. Legal action is funded in all sorts of ways for all sorts of reasons. Often an appeal is funded by the Respondent simply because they want a final answer.

    But here’s the thing…. JACKSON TRIED TO SORT IT OUT WITHOUT LAWYERS! The filthy thieves blocked her and blocked her. Fuck they even funded Thomson in a defense of ripping off THEIR FUCKING MEMBERS!! Jesus Christ you people will defend anything if it’s union. Williamsons rip off amounts to FUCKING MILLIONS!! Ripped off the nation’s POOREST FUCKING WORKERS!!

    But “Shhh Kathy. Don’t tell. We’re union. We’ll sort it out in house. Here love , go buy a nice outfit, we’re going to lunch and we’ll have resolved it by 3. ”

    FMD talk about enablers. No wonder these cnts think they can pull this shit with members like you guys supporting them.

  108. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 5, 2012 4:28 am

    Shows just how little you two know about the law. Legal action is funded in all sorts of ways for all sorts of reasons.

    Well that’s deep james How many years did it take to learn that? 😆

    FMD talk about enablers. No wonder these cnts think they can pull this shit with members like you guys supporting them.

    Now this is where the one-eyed rants come in, I can’t recall TB or myself ever supporting or defending the actions of thomson, williamson or jackson [in fact it is ‘you lot’ who blindly support jackson’s own rorting]. Defending the right to exist for unions, organised labour and collective action does not mean we support corruption and misappropriation of funds and it does not mean that all unions have the same practises.

    Surely in your rush to demonise unions you can also manage to accept that anyone in a position of trust with other people’s money available to them, can be tempted to steal. I’ve stated previously on the GT blog that I don’t believe any employees [company execs, managers, politicians] need a credit card available to them. I can’t see why the same rules shouldn’t apply to all, spend the money from your own pocket, put in the dockets and get reimbursed. If it’s good enough for the lowly workers, it’s good enough for everyone. I think the whole system is open to abuse. How many times have politicians been allowed to pay back thousands when they get caught out. Ordinary workers are handed over to the police but time and time again politicians are allowed to get away with a crime by re-paying stolen funds.

    What about the execs who live the high life on a company credit card, isn’t that shareholders money getting squandered?

    Or the employers who don’t pay their workers superannuation?

    http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/lawyer-jailed-for-stealing-from-clients/story-e6frea83-1111112931700

    A LAWYER burnt out by stress stole trust funds from clients to buy himself luxuries to distract himself from his problems, a court heard today.

    Philip Arthur Templeton, 54, of Hahndorf, was sentenced in the District Court to four years in jail after pleading guilty to five charges of dishonestly taking property without the owner’s consent.

    Templeton transferred $294,325 from clients’ trust accounts into his bank account between February and December 2005.

    The funniest thing happened yesterday, we had the opposition on the airwaves sobbing about labor taking child welfare payments off ‘families’. Suddenly the previously demonised welfare bludging single mothers are ‘families’. Not a mention of sole parents anywhere!

  109. TB Queensland permalink
    May 5, 2012 8:48 am

    But here’s the thing…. JACKSON TRIED TO SORT IT OUT WITHOUT LAWYERS!

    Why? If it’s a legal (actually criminal) matter? What’s her “covert” plan? Her relationships are not exactly conducive to complete trust.

    And the reason I (and I believe KL) get pissed off with you and others is because of the “blanket” statements by you and others that all unions are bad BOO!

    I suspect I know more about the law than you do about the work of unions …

    Its about fkn INDIVIDUALS not ALL union members … just as ALL businesses are not controlled or owned by Robber Barons …

  110. Tony permalink
    May 5, 2012 11:46 am

    ” just as ALL businesses are not controlled or owned by Robber Barons …”

    😯

  111. TB Queensland permalink
    May 5, 2012 2:48 pm

    😉

  112. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 5, 2012 3:37 pm

    😛

  113. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 5, 2012 5:56 pm

    hmmm….

    😀

  114. TB Queensland permalink
    May 5, 2012 6:05 pm

    😆

  115. Tony permalink
    May 5, 2012 6:40 pm

    🙄

  116. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 5, 2012 10:08 pm

    😆

  117. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 5, 2012 10:13 pm

    (/•ิ_•ิ)

  118. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 5, 2012 11:55 pm

    😀

  119. el gordo permalink
    May 6, 2012 6:30 am

    8-0

  120. el gordo permalink
    May 6, 2012 6:32 am

    oops

    😕

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